Well, Dylan was officially 6′3 but he probably fudged it a bit and went for 6′4 as it seems more intimidating.  His mom must’ve taken his word for it as this is the height she mentions throughout her book.  In the Diversion Report intake form which he filled out March ‘98, Dylan offers 6′3.  According to Dylan’s autopsy report he was 6′3.   He may have grown an inch taller by the age of 18 but I think he was pretty much around the end of his growth spurt.

Awh, don’t be shy. 🙂   Sorry to say though, my FB is private and for family and friends.  I’m all about compartmentalization when it comes to the internet..especially running a somewhat controversial blog the likes of E-C. The everyday world ain’t ready for this yet..though a part of it  is apparently, based on the sheer volume of followers I have and quite a few are not of the TCC as of late.. 😉 

Yeah, he definitely listened to Where Do I Begin seeing as it was a track on Dig Your Own Hole.  Mm, I don’t know whether he liked it enough to be fav.  However, he dug the track Block Rockin’ Beats enough to mention adding it as a music for a section for his planned website as well as Elektrobank since he sketched out a t-shirt design for it.

Combo 19-37-9 

Locker No. 837

Sue interviewed a variety of different experts and author sources. Cullen is but one of a few authors that she spoken with along side Andrew Solomon who was doing an eloquent, impeccable job of things with his book Far from the Tree and also various articles he’d written – that is, until he went and pigeonholed both boys in the preface of Sue’s book in a sort of ‘the long and short of it’, labeling statement: “Eric was a failed Hitler; Dylan was a failed Holden Caulfield.”  Solomon seems to have been contaminated by Cullen’s stance. It’s unfortunate too that Cullen has finally gotten the opportunity in attempting to win over Sue’s perspective with his cookbook psychology. It shouldn’t be surprising really because that is what Cullen does, propagate his propaganda any opportunity that comes his way.  Then again, I’m not all that thrilled at the assessment that Peter Langman offered her either.  If you watched the 20/20  program and saw Langman’s simplistic brush stroke analysis of both boys by taking their journals at face value “one has hearts, the other swastikas therefore, one is good and one is evil” brush stroke approach which again, it sounds suspiciously similar to Cullen’s approach as well.  Did it really take Langman that many years of schooling to make a diagnosis like that?  Couldn’t anyone do the same thing he did without psychiatric expertise?  Fact of the matter is, people are told to look to the experts; their opinions hold weight based on credentials, reseach and experience and so (often vulnerable) people searching for answers rely on their expertise for their diagnoses.  Sue has listened to many and she is coming from a place of taking into account what each has said and weighing their opinions in totality.  But I have never once felt while reading her book that she has firmly decided to subscribe only to one particular school of thought.  My sense is that she has tried to remain open and stay firmly on the fence for the most part even though she knows full well, and is high attuned to the fact that her beloved son will always be a bit of an Achilles Heel for her as her child and so she grapples with the tendency to want to absolve him from full responsibility even though she knows full well that he is fully responsible and made those choices willingly for a reason she’ll never be able to completely comprehend.  So, yes, Cullen has gotten to Sue but I don’t think she has become his true believer.  Seems clear to me, especially while listening to the audio version of her narrating her book my second time around, that she’s intelligently nuanced and wise enough to understand that diagnosing brain illness isn’t a black and white, good or bad methodology and that a myriad of factors confluence an individual to deteriorate enough to the point of deciding to kill themselves and/or others. 

No, not really?

Eric’s parents and Dylan’s brother Bryon did not watch the Basement Tapes. Only Dylan’s parents watched the tapes as well as Brook’s Brown’s parents.

“I became fixated on the picture that aired over and over: the most terrible school picture Dylan ever had taken, so unflattering that when he brought it home, I urged him to have it reshot. It made him look like the kind of kid teachers as well as students would find a reason to pick on—the guy you’d move your tray to avoid in the lunchroom. It didn’t look like him. Even in
my near-madness in those early days after the tragedy, I knew how ridiculous it was for me to be upset that the media were using an unbecoming photograph of Dylan, instead of showing him as the nice-looking young man he had been. My son was an alleged murderer—and there I was, dithering over an ugly photo. It was a spectacular example of the tricks the mind plays when we’re juggling unbearable emotions. Absurd as it was, I wanted Dylan to be shown the way I remembered him.”  – Sue Klebold, A Mother’s Reckoning

I go back and forth as to which ‘school picture’ Sue is referring to.  I also thought she might have been referring to Dylan’s Columbine HS school badge (photo on the left) where he has more of a sneer than a smile and his hair looks greasy and combed unevenly off to one side and unabashedly wearing that Serial Killer shirt (mom must’ve loathed that).  But I tend to think it’s not the photo even though it was one of his more unflattering photos for the sheer fact that the media outlets didn’t use this particular photo everywhere – not that I recall anyway.  Instead, the media constantly seemed to use Dylan’s black and white junior class photo (right) ubiquitously, especially on the news on television and it was also attached to his memorial cross, as with Eric’s Junior class photo as well. I have no idea why media outlets perpetually used those out dated photos of Dylan and Eric’s instead of their most current senior photos. 

In any event, I sadly tend to think that Sue is complaining about her son’s appearance in his junior year photo only for the very reason that photo was ubiquitously shown in the early days after Columbine.  Personally, I don’t find it ‘unflattering’ and he doesn’t look like some nerd that’d be ‘picked on or avoided in the lunchroom’.   His eyes have a lovely downward slant in opposition to his eyebrows which flare outward. Granted, his smile looks a little hesitantly awkward and and he has a tiny wee bit of acne on his well endowed chin (a rare thing for the dude, tbh) – but then, Dyl had a history of smiling tentatively in most of his class photos. His sophomore and senior photos are the best in terms of a fully engaged smile.  And of course, we now know that the reason Dyl’s senior photos came out so well is because Zack was there behind the scenes coaxing his timid pal to have a good time during the otherwise stilted, artificial senior photo shoot in the outdoors. (I loved that little tidbit.;))   

The senior photos were finally released to the public in the infamous Time Magazine cover with “The Monster’s Next Door” across the top.  

In any case, I certainly wouldn’t call Dylan’s junior photo ‘ugly’.  In comparison of these two photos, I’d say the one on the left is more uncomplimentary to his features. He seems a bit more gawky and exaggerated and, oh, that trademark Dyl sneer. lol.   Also, too, if it were this particular photo, wouldn’t Sue have pointed out that he was wearing a shirt that said “Serial Killer” on it which she abhorred in light of the fact that he was now seen as killer?  His demeanor seems more suspect and less like a dweeb that would provoke the look of a potential ostracized, bullied victim.  It does seem rather harsh to me that Sue would be this unfiltered and candid about her feelings regarding Dylan’s junior class photo. I wonder too if she potentially argued with Dylan about getting it retaken since she personally felt it wasn’t his best look while he was all ‘meh it’s good enough’. So, maybe these memories of bickering with ‘crabby’ Dyl had a hand in coloring how she felt about the photo and so it’s become rather ironic to her too that this is the very photo that the public plastered everywhere of her son when she feels it does not represent him well.  Still, it’s sad that she’d admit such a thing.  I do tend to think Sue is/was very impeccable about keeping up appearances, holding high standards for herself and others in ‘looking your best’ as much as possible.  She also admits to be a perfectionist, so as that Aries that she is, she seems to be driven that way. I can imagine how annoying it must’ve been for Virgo Dylan to have two Aries parents telling him how to be, do, think and act all the time.

I’d say a good few years for Zach and Devon. They probably stuck together and their relationship deepened impart due to the tragedy and their shared grief over losing friends on both sides of the fence. Nate and Kristi probably lasted a couple of years. Can’t really say for certain on either but that is my sense of what likely happened.  And yeah, Eric and Dylan were basically the Virgin Suicide Killers.  Their self perceived failings in obtaining girlfriends and the overall sense of feeling like rejects had a hand in strengthening their bond and solidifying their malignant alliance. Glad you enjoy E-C. 🙂 

columbinekillers:

When Columbine first happened, there was so much controversy over his death and about who killed him. There was even a rumor that the cops shot him in crossfire. So this led to the Sheriff’s Dept doing an investigation on it. They determined that it was Eric who killed Dan, but the Columbine Report states that it was Dylan. This is why people still don’t agree on it today because one report says Dylan killed him while the other says it was Eric. I believe that it was Eric because the second report by the Sheriff’s Dept came after the Columbine Report, so it’s more like “final evidence” or whatever. But who knows, maybe it was Dylan. @everlasting-contrast @thedragonrampant @columbinecaseinfoblog do one of you know?

You’ve got it right regarding the second report.

The cause of Daniel’s death had been the source of a heated dispute between his parents, Brian Rohrbough and Sue Petrone, and law enforcement. They had alleged Denver police Sgt. Daniel O’Shea accidentally killed his son, while police maintained it was one of the teen gunmen.

Jefferson County investigators had initially reported that Daniel Rohrbough was shot by Klebold, then later said that conclusion was erroneous and Harris was Daniel’s killer. A later investigation by the El Paso County Sheriff’s Office revealed that it was Eric, firing his Hi-Point 9 mm carbine rifle, who killed Dan. [Source]

The murder of Daniel Rohrbough at Columbine High School on April 20, 1999, was undeniably caused by gunman Eric Harris beyond any reasonable doubt, the report findings concluded.

From the Reinvestigation into the Death of Daniel Rohrbough Executive Summary Report, Conclusion of Findings, pages 26-28:

The Chief Engineer for H.P. White Laboratory, Inc., Lester
W. Roane, conducted a microscopic examination on the
items, in the presence of detectives from the El Paso
County Sheriff’s Office. Mr. Roane advised detectives the
bullet recovered from Daniel Rohrbough had eight (8)
lands and grooves, with a right hand twist, which is
consistent with the Highpoint Semi-Automatic Carbine
Rifle. Mr. Roane added the bullet recovered from Daniel
Rohrbough was a textbook match to a test-fired bullet
taken from the Highpoint Semi-Automatic Carbine Rifle. 

Hope that helps. 🙂

The Klebold’s had them yes.  Might want to read the book? 😉

“Our cat Rocky was ill, and I fumbled about for his medicines, conscious of how ridiculous it seemed against the backdrop of the tragedy. Worried our two little cockatiels would not survive the cold night in our car, I grabbed our thickest beach towels to wrap around their cage.”

Mmm..no?   It’s more like I get a lot of questions and can only address so many in a given day.  

Funny how personal perspective is because I don’t see the manner in which you are bitterly pigeonholing her book.    Sue interviewed many people, so-called psych experts, authors, friends and family for insights of which I believe she has openly considered various possibilities based off a myriad of different opinions but in my personal opinion, she has remained largely neutral and still open and in a state of perpetually seeking out answers. Additionally, she has given some of her own opinions based off the various perspectives given to her but is that not her right given that it’s her book and her opinion?  She is also Dylan’s mother and as his mother who has loved and cared for him since a baby it is not always easy for her to stay on the straight and narrow of objectivity one hundred percent of the time. That is an unrealistic expectation to hold over a mother’s head. We could hardly expect the same thing of Kathy Harris in her own memoirs about Eric..if she ever pushed to speak out the way Sue did even at the risk of ending her marriage to Tom in order to speak out.

 You know, it’s too bad the Harrises could not vouch for their own son so Sue could’ve had the opportunity to weigh and consider a more well-rounded perspective about Eric. Too bad his parents damn him further in their silence and are automatically deemed complicit with the majority psych expert opinion that deems him a psychopathic rep all because they refrain from speaking in his defense..

Oh well..It’s not Sue’s job to champion Eric for his own parents.  Sue spent time exploring her overall impressions of Eric based on personal, first hand experience with him.  That’s all anyone can expect of her, honestly.  When there is not enough detailed, intimate information to weigh and consider about Eric, people tend to rely on the psychiatric expert opinions. How could we fault her for looking to the expert opinion for help in her vulnerable desire for answers? That’s a given in America, anyway. 

Sue has been through hell and back and her bravery in coming forward to openly explore a variety of factors that had a hand in influencing her son in addition to admissions about how her own parenting style failed in retrospect, has been nothing but courageous and admirable. I do not agree with your stance to vilify her in cahoots with Cullen.  I do not see that Sue has arbitrarily decided that Eric is responsible for Dylan’s participation in the shooting either but rather a culmination of many factors that influenced Dylan to influence himself to murder and suicide. She even says on many occasions that she knows her son is fully responsible for what he did.  I’d even go so far as to do a post quoting her that demonstrates this is colored, distorted thinking on your part. 

The quote is:

“Dr. Langman believes Dylan’s ambivalence may have extended up to the massacre itself. On at least four occasions at the school—always out of Eric’s earshot and line of sight—Dylan let people go. The physical evidence suggests two incidents during the rampage when Eric went to retrieve Dylan, perhaps to make sure he was still on board. I take no comfort from this— Dylan committed atrocities, end of story. But learning about his ambivalence devastated me. In my notes after a conversation with Dr. Langman, I wrote: Crying too hard to take any more notes….I had made myself accept Dylan as a sadistic killer, but I had not yet come to grips with a Dylan who was trying to counteract his own “evil” with moments of goodness. I think I met this Dylan for the first time when Langman talked about it, so it gave me a different Dylan to grieve for. Dylan’s ambivalence also made me feel even more culpable than I did already.”

I’m going to assume that Langman is sticking to what Cullen mentioned in his book that coincide with this quote:  

“The physical evidence suggests two incidents during the rampage when Eric went to retrieve Dylan, perhaps to make sure he was still on board.”

1) When the boys arrived at the school, Dylan parked in the Senior parking lot and Eric, in the Junior parking lot.  The official record is that the two stood by their own cars waiting for the two bombs to explode in the Commons cafeteria.  Dylan did mention in his basic attack plans jotted out in Eric’s Day Planner that they would wait by their cars. However, I don’t know if this has ever been proven that the two actually did stand by their cars and waited but this is the official story by Jeffco.  After the bombs did not explode, Eric ‘abandoned his prime location to come to Dylan’s post.’ (paraphrasing Cullen here – I won’t quote him specifically but if you haven’t used his book yet for a fire log this winter, you can find the factionized account on the first page of C11 “Female Down”. 😉

2)  The second time is when Dylan walked down the south-west entrance steps, moving away from Eric and he stepped  into the side entrance of cafeteria momentarily. You could say this was a third time (or first if you’re going in order) if you literally relied on Dylan’s sketch of plans written out in the pages of his journal, that he’d be the one to actually walk in and set the bombs.  But it’s not really clear if he’s literally referring to himself specifically for that task or for both of them to set the bombs.

“On at least four occasions at the school—always out of Eric’s earshot and line of sight—Dylan let people go.”

Below, is what I personally count – with some additions that don’t really fit the criteria of Eric being out of earshot/line of sight.  I’m not sure exactly what they’re referring to but likely four within this bunch below.

 1) Sean Graves: When Dylan went down the stairs of the south west entrance he: stepped over Sean Graves who was lying in the threshold of the cafeteria side door.  

2)  Lance Kirklin:  I know no one is going to vouch for this one.. but I half count it 😉  because, let’s face it, at close range looking directly down at Kirklin laying prone on the ground, Dylan could’ve easily shot the kid in the brain and killed him instantly. Instead, he shoots his jaw. He maims him badly.

3) Multiple students Fleeing up the cafeteria stairs:  He walked into the cafeteria for a short time and people were fleeing upstairs yet he shot no one inside the Commons. (Cullen purports  that Dylan stepped inside and waved his Tec in a sweeping motion but did nothing.  I have no clue where/how he came to this conclusion. For this to be a fact, there should be 11K cafeteria witnesses saying they saw Dylan use a sweeping motion with his gun but I haven’t come across any that have reported this. It’s possible they did but I’ve never seen it.)   Personally, I feel as though Dylan stepped inside, paced nervous and excitedly and then left again.  Fact remains though, he did not shoot any fleeing or hiding student alone within the Commons.

4) Girls by the pay phones  When Dylan ran and shot up the main hallway moving towards the school offices near the main entrance, he progressed up to the pay phones near the front doors and scared two girls near the phones/water fountain area.. One girl was speaking to her mother on the phone, dropped the receiver and fled into the girl’s bathroom. The other girl had a visual exchange with Dylan who screeched to a halt and smiled at her. Yet, Dylan, gun in hand, did not pursue her. Instead, he regrouped back down the hallway with Eric.  See post here.

5)  John Savage:  Can’t really count him according to Sue’s specifications – nonetheless, Dylan reasons and decides to spare Savage (”We know each other, I like you, you can leave”) blatantly and within Eric’s sights. 

6)  Valeen Schnurr:  Dylan interacts verbally with her as she’s  crying hysterically on the floor having fallen out from under table yet he chooses to not kill her. 

7)   Evan Todd: can’t really count him since he was in earshot and line of Eric’s sight, but nonetheless, Dylan openly declines killing Todd.

8)  Tim Castle: When E &D  are back down in the Commons in the kitchen area.  Dylan goes into a bathroom or closet area and sees that the ceiling boards are out and he sticks his head up through the boards.  Up above is Dylan’s friend, Tim Castle, trying to flee by crawling through the ceiling area.  According to Tim, the two make eye contact and he recognizes the shooter as Dylan. I believe Dylan signals or gave Time the impression that he could leave. Tim tells all his friends about this in tears. He cannot believe it is his friend.

9) [new update April 2018] Kimberly Blair (Woodruff): Kim was standing on the outside near on the lawn near the south-west entrance with her friend, Anne Marie Hochhalter, and her boyfriend, Jayson Autenrieth. She observed the boys remove their guns from their dufflebags, nod at one another and begin shooting. Dylan looked at her and according to Kim, he purposefully pointed his gun away and shot and wounded the girl next to her (her friend Anne Marie).  She alludes that since she and her sister Patti are identical twins, that Dylan spared Patti in the library as he looked under the table and didn’t shoot her twin probably because he may not have been able to tell them apart.  Kim stated that she knew Dylan and had been kind to him in the interactions that they’d had in school.

Ugh, yesss.  This is one of those tiny yet preciously important detail questions we’re left hanging with. I’m with you…Yes, I’d like to know what happened to Dyl’s sickly older cat Rocky. Who wouldn’t want to know this tidbit of information?  How heartbreaking if Rocky lost the will too live in his illiness not too long after Dylan died?    It’s an interesting parallel with how Eric’s dog Sparky was sickly with seizures and meanwhile, Dylan’s ill feline companion had barfed in the guest bedroom not long after Nate slept over and so Sue asked Dyl to pick up the room so that Eric could spend the night.. one last time. Sue obviously is a huge animal lover and if I had to subtitle this book it would be dubbed: Don’t forget to feed the cats, Dyl !  

Wished she tossed in some photos of Dylan with the kitties and

Cockatiels…

No, I think Eric turned Dyl on to the band and he found he also dug KMFDM too. Hasn’t any of your friends introduced you to different kinds of bands or musical tastes of which you previously hadn’t discovered on your own? Friends influence one another’s tastes and that’s just par for the course. :). There are certain kinds of movies or music that you especially share together with a certain friend and that’s what KMFDM and Rammstein were for Eric and Dylan as a package deal.